Marketing Without a Storefront: Mastering Ghost Kitchens & Virtual Brands with Adam Robbins

Welcome to a milestone episode of the Franchise Whispering podcast! For the very first time in our show's history, we are venturing past the brick-and-mortar and diving deep into the fast-paced, high-tech world of ghost kitchens and virtual brands.

Our guest today is Adam Robbins, a 25-year restaurant industry veteran and operations powerhouse. Adam has transitioned from running traditional, full-service kitchens to mastering the digital frontier, helping to manage 12 massively popular virtual brands—including Pardon My Cheesesteak, MrBeast Burger, and Mukbang Burger—across more than 5,000 kitchens.

In this episode, we unpack the reality of building a brand when your storefront is entirely invisible. How do you drive loyalty, justify delivery premiums, and stand out on crowded apps? Adam pulls back the curtain on how to dominate the delivery game.

In this episode, we cover:

• The Multi-Layered Customer: How to navigate the complex relationships between corporate franchisors, executing franchisees, and the hungry end-consumer.
• Owning the Digital Shelf: Why geo-targeted SEO and fighting to stay "above the fold" on DoorDash, Uber Eats, and Grubhub are the new billboards.
• The TikTok Advantage: Why raw, authentic User-Generated Content (UGC) and viral influencer marketing are crushing traditional, over-styled food photography.
• Innovating for the Commute: The science behind crafting the perfect delivery French fry and why shifting budget from flashy packaging to actual food quality is the ultimate win.
• Creating Unbeatable Value: How pivoting to aggressive, value-driven combo meals drove a massive 40% jump in product mix during economically tight times.

Whether you are a traditional restaurant operator looking to add a lucrative secondary revenue stream or a marketer fascinated by the digital-first food economy, Adam’s insights are an absolute masterclass in adaptation and growth. 

 Tune in and discover how the restaurant industry is evolving! 

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Transcript

0:00

Welcome to the Franchise Whispering uh podcast for franchise marketing news. We are so very, very excited today. A topic uh in our in our young podcast history that we have not uh gotten to yet. And uh really talking to the man that uh might know the most about the the ghost kitchen space, how it works, what's the best way to attribute it, how it interfaces with brands out there. So Adam Robin, super excited. Thank you so much for uh for being a part of that. Excited to be here. Thank you so much for having me. And I have to tell you, it's great. I didn't know I was coming on for a first ever on the podcast. So I really appreciate that. I I'm really excited now. Yeah, yeah. No, I mean the theme today, marketing without a storefront, uh, you know, building 12 virtual brands across 5,000 plus kitchen. I mean, it's uh uh it's quite the story. You know, you've been in the uh the business for so long, uh different brands, big time restaurant group, burger fry, your time at Nordstrom's Texas Roadhouse, et cetera. You know, tell me, you know, give us a little background on, you know, even before the the ghost kitchen thing, uh tell us a little bit about your experiences and such. Yeah, and the overall length of my career, the ghost kitchen piece, the focus on technology, the focus on IP has really been a new opportunity for for myself as well. I I still catch myself when people are asking me, really still focused on the fact that no, I'm a restaurant operator. What are you talking about? I that's all that I do. I'm a restaurant operator. So still very much focused on that in 25 plus years in this industry. I really started in full service dining, grew into fine dining, eventually came into QSRs as that became all the rage, and then had an opportunity to really focus in on the technology side starting in about 2019. So again, still in its infancy and the overall focus and timeline of my career, but yeah, 25 years really focused on how can I first and foremost be the best chef that I could be. Then it was, well, you have to take into account numbers and we have to focus on the PL. So then becoming transitioning from an artist as a chef to now I'm gonna be a kitchen manager, right? I'm gonna manage that PL and my cost of goods and my labor. Then it is you have to look at it from a perspective of a GM of an individual location. Then, of course, as you had the opportunity to graduate in some of these larger organizations, now I have to look at an entire division. I have to look at an entire region. Now I have to be responsible for an entire hundred million dollar PL of the entirety of a company. So had an opportunity to focus on so many different sides of the business. I still am so very much focused on product quality, execution quality. And that's what we now have to focus on with our partners, but I am not the one inside the restaurant executing the product today. I have to focus on how can I connect with all of our large enterprise independent and mid-market partners who are operating one of our 12 brands. Interesting. So does that um when you it sounds like you've got multiple layer of customers now with with this type of model? You know, most people think of, you know, a food franchise brand or a restaurant brand like this as something that uh, you know, it's got obviously the storefront. You work very, very differently. So, you know, kind of take me through the different layers of customers that uh that you have to navigate. That is a really great question. And it adds to the complexity of our business model. It really does. And to the point, uh, probably, you know, on the note specifically for this conversation in this podcast, we have to do so much work with the larger organization and the franchise or of the corporate company, right? IHOP may be a good example of this in the way that we work with them from a corporate perspective, speculating out how we're going to sell, which products we're going to sell, which brands we're going to focus on. Then obviously, we have to make the transition to very quickly talk about how we're going to work with all of the franchisees, right? Hundreds of franchisees across thousands of locations that we're providing brands and a service to. So now I'm either going to sell to those franchisees, ask them if they're going to be opting in, or understanding if they're interested in taking the next step to bring in additional revenue or to save them revenue in regards to some of the items that we add or offer for our tech side of the company. So then we still have to never lose focus of the fact that we are a food service brand and company. We have to be looking at the customer in the traditional sense, the end user. Who is ordering Pardon My Cheesesteak? Who's ordering Mr. Beast burger? Who is ordering Man versus Fries or a Mukbang burger or any of the other brands that we're focused on? So, yes, we have to divide our time on taking care of our customers first and foremost as the franchisee and franchisors that we work with. But then again, I have an entirely separate team completely focused on guest relations, guest service, always making sure that we are supporting the guest and ensuring a great quality product is being delivered each and every single time. Now, and what is the take me through the end consumer now in that as you navigate that you've you laid out, you know, the franchise E, you're getting there, your value proposition, get some more revenue. Um, at these times you probably wouldn't. I'm sure you've got a very efficient model for which some to which for which they work through. But tell me about the relationship with the end consumer. How do you make that more robust? Well, it's anyone with one of these, right? And that wasn't an iPhone commercial, I promise you that. But as I just picked up my phone to specifically look at DoorDash or at Uber Eats or Grubhub or Seven Now or so many others, Favor and otherwise, that's the end consumer, right? That's the end user of who is focusing on purchasing our products. And it's not the only way that we sell or have access to purchase our products through Pardon My Cheesesteak. You know, you can go direct to consumer through our websites, mrbeastburger.com, right? Or pardonmychees.com, man versus fries.com. But anyone who is on a delivery platform who's looking for a convenient way to have food delivered to them, they are probably more familiar with our brands than their standard brand down the road because we are so prevalent on these delivery platforms because our entirety of our business is 95 plus percent focused on the DSPs, the delivery service providers. So anyone who's going online looking for a product or they want something delivered to them, they want something quick and easy for lunch, for dinner, for late night, right? They don't feel like going out in the middle of the night. They want something delivered to them in the comfort of their own home. That's the end user. That's the customer, that's the consumer, which I think, as everybody knows, has continued to grow, obviously since the pandemic, when everyone found that there is, wow, this way that I can have something delivered to me in-house. I don't even have to leave for it. And of course, right, numbers spiked tremendously during that. The whole world was shut down. You could only get food delivered to you in this way. And we we found a new model of operating. Since that time, every restaurant that I've talked to made the assumption that, all right, we were at 90 plus percent of our sales being provided by digital orders and delivery. We'll get back to normal where it's five, 10, 15%. And what we're hearing time and time again, and I have the numbers to prove it as well, is that never happened. The numbers came back down, but the numbers came down and normalized 20%, 25%. In a lot of cases, what we're seeing as they continue to grow, especially over the past three, four, five years since normalization has happened, 40 plus percent. I can point to five different articles that talk about this across the entirety of the industry, but I can also point to five different partners that are seeing this growth in their digital sales, a huge part of that digital sales strategy in working with them. But 40 plus percent of their orders coming from outside of the restaurant, coming from online through delivery platforms and with virtual brands. It's it's astonishing. It's amazing. No, and McKinsey and company said that uh during the COVID lockdown, the consumer catapulted 10 years in digital acumen during that 90-day lockdown. And you can't unring that bell because everybody's talking value these days, right? And our premise here at the agency is still the number one value proposition is convenience. If you're not dialed in convenience, then that makes it tough. So, you know, tell me what does local marketing look like when your unit is invisible? Really great question. Uh, before I get to that, I I have to mention, as you started to say it, and we were talking about McKenzie and company, and you talked about that acumen of the consumer that jumped a decade in advance. I started to write it down just as you said it. I was writing in big bold letters on a piece of paper in front of me, convenience. And that's exactly the focus, right? The end user, whether it is what so many people refer to as these Gen Z millennials and Gen Alpha focus on that convenience, it's just not true. It's across the entire breadth of the consumer and everyone in the US, especially, but we see this internationally as well. So convenience and value is still a focus. So you're right. I love that number and that perspective to say that the consumer really did jump 10 years in their acumen in just a small period of time. But the way that we have to market to each of the end users is heavily focused on the platforms themselves. So much of our budget is really spent on geo-target locating individuals close to any of our restaurant partners? Are you in close proximity to a IHOP, to a Chuck E. Cheese, to a Perkins or California Pizza Kitchen, to a Ruby Tuesday, to a TJ Fridays, all of our large enterprise partners, so many more. But are you close to one of those locations? What are you looking for and searching for online? And how can we make sure we are owning that SEO, that search engine optimization in your specific geotargeted area? Are we owning that for that food category? Are we focused on cheesesteaks in that area? Is that area more focused on a Tex-Mex offering, a French fry, a chicken offering, all of which we have brands that are related to. But it's so much of online and purpose-driven local marketing for the search engine optimization for the SEL for text message and email marketing in those areas. But then again, never forgetting the fact that we have to be above the fold on DoorDash, Grubhub, and Uber Eats every time, right? If you're on page 10, no one's finding you, right? So we have to make sure because they may be going online to look for McDonald's or Burger King or Popeyes or any of these other brands, Texas Roadhouse, you know, any of these Chick-fil-A. But if they don't find us first, right, we don't have the banner outside that brick and mortar location or the billboard stating come to Chick-fil-A just down the road. So our billboards, our banners have to be built online in these platforms. And then we have to accompany it with here's a tremendous offer for new customers, existing customers, laps customers, return customers. So we have to really focus that and really balance that out with a huge push to make sure anyone who's coming on any of these platforms see us first and foremost before they see their recognizable brands. That's interesting. That's gotta be the key, right? Because the one thing is uh, you know, we work with food franchise brands exclusively at the agency. And I gotta say, we the third-party delivery drives us crazy a little bit. We think if you're a brick and mortar location, there's ways to avoid third-party delivery, which would actually help you in the end because because it, you know, kills first party data. If you're not doing it right outside the restaurant, you lose possible brand quality, you lose brand lifetime value because you don't have the first party data. So really being all over those third-party apps for you has got to be the critical key, right? Without a doubt. But to your point, no one is going to come back if they don't enjoy the product as well, right? So that's the first start, which is the customer acquisition. We are heavily focused on that in regards to 100% our responsibility comes into that customer acquisition for our partners, right? For the operating location who's executing our brand, we have to get the customer for them. But from there, it has been so much focused on our team of how do we innovate our products that are specific made for delivery? How do we innovate our packaging that's specifically made for delivery? How do we continue to use that keyword of innovate, innovate, innovate to ensure that the quality of product that we're delivering is going to be head and shoulders above anyone else that's delivering a similar product? And we see our partners take a page out of our book after they see, wait a second, this is how you wrap and roll your cheesesteak, secure the cheesesteak, package steak to ensure that it gets to the customer hot, melted, cheesy, looks beautiful. And you still have a QR code, you still have a bag sealer, you still have a menu identification card that goes along with it. So we've seen so many of our partners say and realize, oh my goodness, we're we're 10 years behind on innovating our packaging and our delivery products. So we we've had to focus on that tremendously and be able to bring that as well. Here's a leg up for each and every single one of you partners that are gonna be executing our brands because not only do we have to make sure that the food gets there and it's still of great quality, even if it is 30 minutes later via delivery. We have to think so far beyond just how we're going to deliver it. It's also about the quality of the products as well. Like uh shameless plug for a Lamb Weston partner of ours. But and I gotta, I'm gonna have to ask for some money now because Lamb Weston isn't giving us any money. But Lamb Weston is a partner who has innovated with their French fries for years. And it constantly reminds me when I look at the product that gets delivered for man versus fries that is inside of a two-pound burrito or inside of a three-pound fries. Those fries are specifically made for delivery. They're extra crispy, they're coated, they're seasoned. Everything about that fry, because they have 55 different options of product, was specifically made for our brand to focus for delivery and to be delivered 30 minutes later. No, that's so interesting. So I mean, you manage 12 different brands and uh, you know, that's a lot. Was there any particular have you ever turned down a product because you just couldn't, you know, you you won't you weren't happy enough with the quality if it got delivered at 45 minutes? Was it, you know, because when I think of different products for delivery, I think of hard shell tacos and I think of no what? Was there any brands that you kind of stayed away? You don't have to name the brand, but any particular product line that you're like, I don't think this is gonna work out. Yeah, don't don't get me in trouble for naming a couple different brands of approach test for that. And that's not even on them, it's just the the products uh delivery mechanism. It's it's got a what do they call that? A second life or whatever. It only lasts uh a few yeah, yeah. They're they're half-life of part of their delivery, right? So, yes, a tremendous amount. I just had this conversation yesterday with another one of our partners that was asking me about a few different brands that had approached them and thought we might be interested in in acquiring the brand. And we have done that in the past. We have acquired brands to be a part of our portfolio because we've seen that we can take them to the next level with our partners and with our portfolio. But yes, we turn down products as far as when we innovate on menu items constantly. We turn down brands constantly that want to work with us because they've seen how successful our model has been. We've done this time and time again with again, without naming the specific cuisines or brands. Again, just in the past couple months, probably six different brands that were focused on products that we just didn't feel would be the right fit for our partners. We either didn't see the demand for that specific cuisine or product, or we felt it was an inferior product and didn't want to execute something that is already going to be judged more harshly because it's for delivery, right? We're already at a disadvantage of I don't have the opportunity to win back the guest. If they're trying the food right in front of me at a restaurant, I can come right by the table, I can ask them how everything is. My goodness, we forgot a topping for you. I'll get that for you right now. You need a little bit more ketchup for that, your French fries to your liking, you'd like them a little bit cooked more extra crispy. All those things I could handle for someone if they're in-house. For us, we never have that ability. So we're at such a disadvantage that we know that we need to be over the top in our selection of quality products, brands, and cuisines. And so, I mean, obviously, there's uh, especially on the brand building component of all of this, you know, and then certainly some of the brands you carry, there's a there's a user-generated content, there's an aspect to it that really lends itself. You know, tell us a little bit about your UGC strategy and and some of the things that have come out. Yeah, I think you and I talked about this off camera previously, which is user-generated content for us is so unbelievably important because at the end of the day, it's the way that you can advertise to the consumer that I think does make all the difference in this world with social media, with the way that a new generation, these Gen Z, Gen Alphas, want to be advertised to or marketed to. So again, it goes to us to say we want to choose products and brands that lend themselves to that virality uh of anyone can go online and see uh a mukbang, right? I I talk about mukbang burger today. Yeah. And either you're in the no or you're like, what is this wild name for a company and brand that you came up with? I said, we didn't coin the phrase. This has been around for some time. And Korean and Japanese influencers coined mukbangs. And from there, we had an opportunity to focus on mukbang burger. And now, if you go on and search for that, we're one of the first results that come back. So it is lending from the mukbang name, the fact that influencers every single day are creating mukbangs on their own, right? A video in front of a camera just like this, in your car, enjoying the food and the product. I could do it. We we've had our founder, Robert Earl Sr. doing mukbangs on camera before. It's fantastic. I think it's the best unreleased footage that we have, and I should start to market it, but I think yeah, but I think he'll kill me. But again, we found that that is the right way to help market these products. So I'm not selling you something that looks overly fixed, overly filtered. I mean, the fake products that you put together using lard or spray bottles to create an item for a food photo. Most of our food photos are user-generated content, UGC. Someone on their break really enjoyed the product and they posted it to their social media. We reach out to them and said, We loved your video. We love your photos. Could we use that for our brand? Of course, they're very much willing to have their items reposted. But for us, it goes back to we're being genuine. That's our product. That's how it comes when it looks when it's delivered. It's not a food photography still image. That's exactly how it looks when it comes to you. That's how you're going to enjoy it. And that's how we want our customers to see the product being promoted to them. That's exactly how you're going to enjoy it, your friends and and fellow family members who are already enjoying the product. And how can we get you to be a part of our community to now enjoy that product? Now, when we talked before, you had mentioned that that you're getting a more engagement, more consideration through like TikTok rather than Instagram. Can you talk a little bit about that? Why you think that is? Yeah, we've had this amazing partnership with TikTok over several years. We created a brand for TikTok, a creators kitchen, as seen on TikTok. We have included so many creators into their marketplace, how we work with them, how we work with them across our other brands as well. So, yes, I think we're very unique and a little bit ahead of the game, right? I think in the next five, 10 years, we're gonna see even more of this along with autonomous delivery and so much, right? I think this is all going to come to a head where the drone or the autonomous vehicle is going to be delivering your product from one of these items, and you will have ordered it directly through TikTok or Instagram. Instagram or touched it on your TV to order. Instead of even going to what already is a big step forward onto DoorDash and ordering it. So we feel that we're ahead of the game in that we have really gotten TikTok working for us. And we have over 300 million views on TikTok with very few videos that have gone viral. And, you know, that is just looking at some of our best performing videos for some of our best performing brands. That is not an overall aggregation of all views across all brands. So for the viral videos that have been posted on TikTok, we have been able to make those work for us and worked with those creators and reposted it. Again, user generated content. So so bringing it back all together. But we've we do focus on Instagram, we do focus on Meta, we do focus on every other platform as well. But the fact that TikTok has been so successful for us, I think is surprising to so many to hear. But again, we have purposely continued to lead on TikTok because we know it has so much more runway as uh as the future continues. Now I love that. Now tough question so third party delivery is expensive. How do you you know the customers are feeling it it's you know high value times right now. You know how do you justify the price point? How do you make the consumer feel good about the purchase? It is extremely tough. It's difficult for everyone in this space and everything is expensive today, right? You can't pass a single headline without someone having the conversation about gas prices. And I'll be the first one to tell you it hits me too. I live about two hours south of my office. So commuting into my office I feel that uh that gas price hike quite a bit that's why I have to have so many pictures of of the family next to me because it's a long day away from them here in the office. You should deliver some product on the way. Yeah yeah exactly I could be the the most prolific DoorDash driver that they've ever seen delivering from Palm Beach Gardens, Florida all the way up to Orlando. Legend in one day, right? But the reason why we have again had to innovate in the offerings that we put forth on the platforms is because again we know this is a challenge the price the pricing of the product the price that the end user is paying the cost associated with DoorDash raising their prices and fees and Uber Eats and Grubhub raising their prices and fees. So again we have to be overly concerned with that. We have to be so far ahead of the game so my team will tell you this that I drive them nuts on when you say value, I say value yo, you've mentioned it 20 times in in this conversation. I mention it 20 times in every conversation that I have with them. And every single one of our LTOs this year launched in 2026, every single one of them has been a value driven LTO. How do we now offer the chopped cheese is a really great example of this and it's a chopped cheese cheesesteak that we offer on pardon my cheesesteak. We also have a chopped cheese on mukbang burger but how can we offer this chopped cheese product with the cider fries and potentially a drink for maybe just a dollar more in most cases? Well you're giving them four, five, six, $10 in value for just another dollar. And the way that we have to do that again is continue to innovate with products and where we're getting the products from and the cost of those products and how we work with our partners to either subsidize some of their marketing costs or subsidize some of their promotion costs. How can we work with our other partners across the food product, the drink product, with Pepsi in in particular with Craft Times on the ketchup that we're offering as well. And these are really good examples of how can we work with the partners and the vendors that are a part of our ecosystem and a part of our product system to give discounts to offer value to every single one of our consumers because that's how we stay relevant. Again, you value value one of the biggest ways that we've been able to continue to stay top of mind for everyone really interesting statistic is we're looking at our our product mix across all of our pardon my cheesesteak locations just this past week. And we traditionally see about 6% of each of our LTOs or each of our combos in a week to week product mix report that we run. So maybe 12% max of the sales are coming from combos we have seen in the past two months that grow to 40% of our product mix. That is by all accounts a huge jump. Not even necessarily one that we expected but one that we are tracking very intently to say wow we were on the right track. We said we wanted to innovate a LTO a limited time offer focused on value and our consumers are really responding to it. 40% of our sales coming from combos and we only have two combos on the menu focused on that so one of them's a new product that we released the chopp cheese combo. So that's how we're able to really focus on not only the quality and the product and the value but again the overall price point right which all feed into the overall thought process of value. That uh that that that is very very interesting and how to keep the value where it where it needs to be in a time like this right now the Mr. Beesper was kind of the first big breakout virtual brand during the COVID and everything. The category got really hot obviously with COVID and and those type of things and then a lot of operators started to started pulling back a little bit on secondary brands and those type of things what did you you know with that shakeout what did you kind of learn from from that experience and and how did the how did the brands change? We learned so much over the past several years. And I'll tell you I was fortunate enough to be a partner of VDC's prior to coming to work with VDC. So in the several years it was four years that I was a partner of VDC's where I was either operating their brands with other companies or continuing to sell those brands and I found a lot of notes that I wanted to come to the company with. And I think it was a big part of the conversation before I came on board was well what do you all think about maybe reducing some of the packaging SKUs that our partners need to utilize to execute one of our brands. And at the time the conversation very much was well that's a key differentiator right they they want this really great beautiful packaging and this branding again because we don't have our own storefront, a physical storefront per se, right? That is a a big focus in a way that we can really differentiate ourselves is this beautiful packaging and branding very colorful bags, very colorful boxes, stickers and etc. So one of the ways that we have changed and learned over the years of can we focus on reducing the cost for our partners on packaging and also giving it more of a grassroots feel as again, instead of it being overly produced, right? Do I have to give you that burger in a bright blue box with another sticker on top inside of a bright blue bag with a bright blue cup or can it give you that exact same product and really put more of the focus, time, effort, energy and cost into the quality of the product and only focus on let's call it a sticker to identify the brand for it. And I think so many different brands have have learned this as well because I see it all the time on how the food is being delivered to me. We don't want to cut corners on quality. So if it affects the quality of how the product's going to be delivered, that's not the case, right? We spend so much time focusing on how that cheesesteak can get to you nice and hot and melty and gooey. But we wanted to reduce cost for our operating partners as just one example of how we learned from the first launch with Mr. Beef's burger into maybe our latest launch with Empanadas United, Mukbang Burger and Burrito Cartel. Those brands all have very few packaging SKUs with identifiable stickers and not this overly produced branded product. Oh that's so interesting that uh and like you said if you can get the quality on the product right that's uh that's that's the fulfillment of value. Yeah I'll I'll put my my dollars behind the innovation of quality of the product 10 out of 10 times as opposed to putting it just behind branded packaging. I love that we're about ready to wrap it up but you know um what does it look like for the next 12 months in the in this space? I think there's really growth only in sight, not only just for us but for our partners in a time where everyone in this industry has to become very creative in the way that they are marketing themselves, the way that they are finding ways to grow profitably in this space how can they continue to increase traffic? How can they win back traffic when there's so many people struggling companies struggling and this part of the industry struggling? You know, again we're continued to be focused on driving those digital sales for our partners which I've been to six conferences already this year and countless more in the next couple months it's it's a lot. And every single person that I talk to when they talk about how bleak the outlook is based upon the cost of beef or the cost of gas or overall consumers for one partner or another, we have the luxury of being able to produce products and brands and provide products and brands for partners across the spectrum is it a QSR is it fast casual is it full service and the way that we see each of them focused on the individual brands and products that we bring them is is fantastic. So we've still grown we've still offered new and additional brands and new and additional products we've still innovated new LTOs and value driven propositions and combos and they're still growing in that manner as well. So I still see there's plenty of runway for us to continue to grow for our partners to continue to grow in this space. It's just about shifting the mindset of where you're going to grow are you going to grow with in-store traffic which we can absolutely provide and support on as well in so many different ways collaborations and in-house specials and opportunities or are you going to be able to grow via virtual brands very via digital sales and otherwise and that's inclusive of first party as well right doesn't have to only be on third party DSPs as well. So plenty of room to grow I think we will continue to to be the leader in the space we will continue to support all of our really fantastic partners and and large enterprise groups that we work with and we hope they will continue to be just as successful as as we've been over the the past 10 years. Well I knew this normally our podcast lasts around 25 minutes but I knew this one was going to go over because it is so very very interesting so very very innovative and I could talk for another half hour but I know you're a busy man. So you know Adam thank you so much thank you for letting us uh sharing these stories from virtual dining concepts and uh being a part of this franchise whispering podcast we usually like to keep it to marketing people but your COO uh background and everything flowed perfectly so thank you so much. Really appreciate it Bob really excited to have spent the time and listen first ever time that we're talking about marketing on storefronts that don't exist in a physical fashion. So love you. Love it we're staying on the cutting edge. Thanks uh thanks so much. All right